RE: [libreoffice-accessibility] IAccessible2 / LibreOffice / OpenOffice.org

Hi Christopher, Dennis, All,

At 06:41 9-9-2011, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> (...)
> OK, now a long message about IAccessible2 and what is happening with 
> respect to Apache OOo: Another place to look for IAccessible2 code 
> is in the separate CWS (Child Work Spaces) of OpenOffice.org.  This 
> is where features are often developed before they are ready to bring 
> back into the main development.  You can see all of the repositories 
> at <http://hg.services.openoffice.org/>. You can browse them from 
> the web, but it is all code. It looks like cws/accfixes2, 
> cws/accfixes3, cws/accia2bridge (very promising), and cws/accstuff 
> are where anything is.

Thanks for pointing that out. I was not aware of these Child Work Spaces.


> They all belong to Malte, also. Other than that, I would ask Malte 
> Timmerman.  Try malte@apache.org
>
> On 2011-07-13 Rob Weir announced that some code from Symphony would 
> also be contributed to the Apache OOo project.  In that 
> announcement, Rob mentioned that there is later IAccessible2 work in 
> Symphony, suggesting it would work better to rely on that improved 
> version.  The contribution has not happened yet.

The contribution has not yet made it to the trunk, but this can still happen.
Rob Weir is also the person at IBM whom I contacted ("rcweir" on 
Apache OpenOffice.org and Twitter).


> The current focus on the Apache Podling is cutover of the 
> Oracle-licensed code and migration of the OpenOffice.org site and 
> services.  My impression is that accepting more contribution will 
> likely follow  development activity for OpenOffice distributions 
> getting back on its feet at Apache.  The effort to accomplish that 
> is just beginning now.
>
> Another place to follow this activity and ask more questions is the 
> freshly-minted ooo-users@incubator.apache.org list.  It is much 
> quieter than the ooo-dev@i.a.o list.  To subscribe, send an e-mail 
> to ooo-users-subscribe@inclubator.apache.org from the e-mail address 
> you want to receive list messages from.  Then follow the 
> instructions sent in reply to confirm your subscription. There is no 
> separate accessibility list for the Apache OOo project.

Thanks. I was not aware of that list.


> I advise staying on LibreOffice lists as well as any @openoffice.org 
> lists that you may already be on.  It is important to remember that, 
> especially now, all development on OpenOffice.org is by volunteers, 
> and volunteers work on what volunteers work on.  Even if some of the 
> volunteers are supported by their employers, for Apache they are 
> still volunteers and the Apache OOo project cannot instruct 
> volunteers on what there is to work on.  The project can identify 
> opportunities and arrange a roadmap, but how that road is ultimately 
> paved is up to the efforts of volunteers.
> One thing that is useful: If the Apache OOo effort does produce an 
> improved accessibility integration, it will likely be adaptable into 
> LibreOffice.  It may not be without effort, but could be much less 
> painful than having to do it over again from scratch.  I am certain 
> that the Apache OOo project will be quite willing to accept 
> suggestions and discuss approaches with the LibreOffice team and any 
> other team.  The early learning-curve part of an effort like this 
> always seems painfully slow.  January will look much different than 
> September.  May will be different yet.

I am looking forward to the accessibility improvement. When I make 
presentations about odt2daisy and odt2braille, two extensions that 
export to DAISY books and Braille respectively, one question I always 
get from the audience is when the accessibility of OpenOffice.org or 
LibreOffice on Windows will be improved.

Best regards,

Christophe


> -
> Dennis
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Chaltain [mailto:chaltain@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2011 19:47
> To: accessibility@global.libreoffice.org
> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-accessibility] IAccessible2 / LibreOffice 
> / OpenOffice.org
>
> I haven't looked into this issue as much as others, but what's left 
> here for IBM to do? It sounds like they've already donated the code. 
> BTW, who in IBM did you contact? I used to know some of the guys 
> working on accessibility inside IBM. On 08/09/11 12:25, Kevin 
> Cussick wrote: > Hello, > > All read and understood. > > Thanks for 
> your explanation,  I have to say it seems that oo and IBM are > 
> dragging there feet with this one. > > I have been in touch with 
> malt Timmerman over the last year or so but I > have not really 
> gotten anywhere. > > I hope you will keep us vi users informed if 
> you hear of ia2 support > being added into the code. > > The reason 
> that accessibility is not switched on by default in oo is > that it 
> does take a bit longer because the program has to shake hands > with 
> access bridge and window's. > > I am not a programer but I would 
> like to have the program just work out > of the box like sinthony 
> does. > > This code has been around for quite some time now and for 
> some reason it > seems that oo does not seem to want to get on and 
> put it into the program. > > The last time i asked about this on the 
> oo list I was told that it will > be ready when it's ready not very 
> helpful.  I look forward to hearing > good news in the near future 
> P.S I use nvda for window's an open source > screen reader I am sure 
> you have heard of it but just in case you can > check it out.. > > 
> On 08/09/2011 13:49, Christophe Strobbe wrote: >> Hi Kevin, 
> All, >> >> (I'm answering Kevin's question in a separate 
> thread.) >> >> When I browsed the OpenOffice.org source code at >> 
> <http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/source.html>, I found a 
> lot >> of Java Accessibility code but nothing that looked like 
> IAccessible2 >> code (which should contain some names starting with 
> IAccessible...). >> Unless I looked in the wrong place, there is no 
> IAccessible2 code that >> can be reused by LibreOffice. I have asked 
> where the IAccessible2 code >> ended up on two mailing lists and 
> contacted someone at IBM (i.e. the >> person who seemed to have 
> checked in most of the source code). I have >> not received any 
> answers, so I don't know what is going on. In my >> opinion, this 
> makes a rather strange impression, especially since IBM >> 
> reportedly donated that code to Oracle and an Oracle developer wrote 
> in >> June (on the Apache Incubator list) that he was quite sure it 
> would find >> its way to Apache OOo... >> >> I hope Oracle and/or 
> IBM will soon clarify the situation. As long as it >> remains 
> unclear if the IAccessible2 code will be released or not, >> 
> LibreOffice cannot decide whether it should reuse the code or 
> reinvent >> that particular wheel. >> >> The LibreOffice bug about 
> enabling AT support during the installation is >> still open: 
> <https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=39803>. >> >> >> At 
> 13:29 8-9-2011, Kevin Cussick wrote: >> "(...) Can someone give a 
> summary to how ia2 support is coming along? or >> maybe not? i have 
> heard it is now being worked on is this true? I would >> like to be 
> able to just download and install without going threw hoops >> to 
> get it working with the access bridge software. If ia2 is not 
> being >> worked on at the moment I think the accessibility switch 
> should be on >> buy default or if not during install you should be 
> asked do you want >> this switched on buy default? and do you want 
> to install the access >> bridge? this would be OK until such times 
> the ia2 support that has been >> in sinthony for a long time now 
> makes its way into the current code with >> thanks as 
> always." >> >> >> Best regards, >> >> Christophe >> >> >> > -- 
> Christopher (CJ) chaltain@gmail.com

--
Christophe Strobbe
K.U.Leuven - Dept. of Electrical Engineering - SCD
Research Group on Document Architectures
Kasteelpark Arenberg 10 bus 2442
B-3001 Leuven-Heverlee
BELGIUM
tel: +32 16 32 85 51
http://www.docarch.be/
Twitter: @RabelaisA11y
---
Open source for accessibility: results from the AEGIS project 
www.aegis-project.eu
---
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